Trouble With Other People's Emotions

[batgirl]

I am wondering if anyone has trouble with the emotions of other people, especially sadness and anger. I am not good at expressing my own emotions or even identifying what I am feeling at any given time, but I also really really hate it when other people express their emotions. I had to leave a therapy group I was in because I couldn't stand it when the other members cried or hugged each other. I kind of panic inside and feel like I want to bolt away.

A couple of weeks ago, my landlady had this huge fight with her teenage niece who lives here as well (I live in a large house that has been divided up into apartments). I witnessed part of the fight and it made me so sick that I couldn't eat properly for about a week and had more nightmares than usual. I now feel some resentment and even hatred towards my landlady and her niece for having the fight, and want to avoid them at all costs.

Anyways just wondering if this is a problem for anyone else.

[Farmer]

Oh Ya it drives me nuts to see other people fight, maybe it has to do with the emotional numbing and can't relate or something. If people start up even if I do not know them I want to leave.

[Marlene]

I've always been very sensitive to other people's moods and emotions. Since the PTSD symptoms started, it's gotten worse. I 'pick up' (to the point I feel like I'm feeling someone elses emotions) on the emotions so easily now that I have to work very hard to block them out. Negative ones are the worst for me, too. I hear people arguing in the checkout line at the grocery store, I have to damn near nail my feet to the floor to keep from just bolting out.

[veiled]

Umm "sensitive" to others moods. I think women's intuition, like females being able to more readily read body language is pretty normal. So we seem to "know" what other's are feeling. Not hype, been proven.

But caring? I am just learning to genuinely give a rats ass if others are upset. Being a mom I do care about how my kids felt and husband, but it did not rub off on me or bring me down. I did not know when to or know how to respond. Being here I am learning to feel others' pain. I think because I am healing slowly and others "get it" and I "get them". It is a start. So another person's pain emotional or physical I have always had a hard time caring.

Now anger... directed at me or not I have had an extremely hard time backing down. Before I may have jumped right in telling them both how big of idiots they were or if one being the obvious ass go after that one. Agoraphobia aspect seemed to go away to the point of not behaving as I should in public (but still be pushed enough by it to actually interact in public) then but I would be left with a panic attack afterwards. I May still, I don't get out enough to tell you.

When learning to control my own anger I had to learn not to get pissed at stupid people (working on it) as I hold it in and it comes out as a anexiety/panic attack... Doc had been dealing with me being that way at home as far as anger and last time I was with my family and around idiots fighting in public yelling and cussing up a storm 3 adults. 1 woman and 2 men an little kid listening with them I was so pissed. They had parked next to where hubs did. But doc had said "don't act" I did well. I just laid on the horn for about 10 or 15 seconds. Looked out my window and told them I have kids in my car that don't need to hear your crap and profanities. They shut up. I did not confront getting out of my car. Hubs "loves" having me go the store with him as I don't/won't get out and he never knows what I will behave like.

But looking back at times I did this it was where those others' actions would impact (in front) my kids or those less able. Not as random I had thought. But when people do go after another I usually do see an "innocent" involved.

Do I care? Not really like I said I have learned to care about others' feelings here with relating and helping and being helped back. Those few people have impacted my life. Sometimes I can be to be sympathectic as I type; I have reasoning as I see what I say and can hit back space and don't want Anthony reaming me and aginst rules flaming, or I do not respond if there is there is no way I can say anything but you are a huge dumbass. Been a couple times. Some people say things and I think :stupid:

Make sense? I feel for others now more than I did before as I am not being let down and don't want to let down others now. So now I am more apt to help where I can and give my spin here. Public face to face not so yet.

Hope it made sense.

[reallydown]

Hi batgirl,
yeah, i often have trouble identifying how i'm feeling, let alone expressing it...other times it just comes out as rage...i also often want to bolt when others express their emotions...i don't even know how to handle my own let alone someone else's...i don't know if that makes sense...i've only had about 6 hours of sleep in the alst 3 days...

[kimG]

When I see and/or hear people arguing, I just want to tell them both to shut the hell up. It drives me nuts and actually triggers me, especially if they don't stop. I have learned to get myself away from the situation, but it still isn't easy.

I have to be held back and kept from leaving my job to go after an abuser when I find out one of my students is being abused.

There are times when people are sad and I feel sad too. But more often I feel like telling them to build a bridge and get over it.

I also have trouble empathisizing with my students when they get in trouble. Too often I hear they are getting a lesser consequence for a negative action because "they come from a bad home." My standard response is, "I came from a bad home too, but I didn't screw up in school."

[piglet]

Also not good with other people's emotions. I'm not good with my own and it makes me feel insecure and abnormal when people around me are showing theirs. Anger is to be avoided at all cost, and crying - well, what do you do with a crying person??????

[batgirl]

Wow thanks everyone for your responses. I guess I'm definitely not the only one who feels this way.

That's a good point about emotional numbing, Farmer. I often secretly feel superior to other people because I'm in control and/or numb and they're not. But the reality is I'm terrified of their feelings, and probably mine too.

Piglet, I agree, I have no idea what to do with a crying person either!! I mean I see what others do... hug them, hand them tissue or whatever, but I can't imagine myself doing that. I have trouble with empathy, like you mentioned, kimG. I often think that people's problems or situations are not nearly as bad as mine, so therefore they shouldn't be complaining or carrying on about it. Not sure in my case if that's the PTSD though or just family background... my father was the same way. He used to tell us not to complain about anything because he had seen worse in the service. Triggered is a good way to describe my feelings about certain emotions though, so thanks. I never thought of it as a trigger.

No you made total sense reallydown. That's exactly how I feel! Same with you, Marlene. I didn't realize anyone else wanted to bolt from the grocery store!! That happens to me quite frequently. People drive me crazy.

You also make sense veiled. I'm not really at the point yet where I feel for other people face to face, although reading people's stories on this forum, I feel empathy. I think it's the actual emotional responses face to face that really get to me and make me shut down.

[Boo-Damphir]

Here's another spin on why many of us have problems being empathetic with other peoples emotions:
We are operating in a stripped-down bare survival mode. We don't have the luxury other people do of feeling secure, safe, and well. So while others are able to be comforting, nurturing or therapeutic with people in an emotional storm- it's all we can do to put the left foot in front of the right foot and walk somedays.

When we are confronted with someone elses emotional needs, we just don't have the energy reserves left to put ourselves behind and reach out to them. We cut to the quick whether in thought or in actual words with comments like "stop whining" and the like.

Is this good or bad? Probably somewhere in the middle. I like honest people and have little patience for those who pussy-foot around me. Just get to the point and we'll be just fine. That isn't always the best response; other people may interpret me as being an unkind bitch. Humans loved to be stroked and told, "I'm listening, I care, your feelings matter."
The down side is that it requires a lot of energy to do. The up side is that it is immensly rewarding.

Just know yourself. If you are unable to "be there" for someone else's emotional needs then don't. But I would advise to periodically just give it a try. As we all go through various stages of healing our capacity for empathy will wax and wane. Nothing is permanent.

[reallydown]

Thanks for that Boo--nicely put...yeah...sometimes it's not that I don't want to be there...but I (and this may sound weird) I just don't know how to be there for someone in a way that's helpful...

[Nam]

I had/still have huge problems with this. My husband claims I'm really insensitive to other people's feelings. Well, when someone is crying because for some stupid reason when I can't even cry at a funeral of a close friend, well, it drives me nuts! It goes for anger too. People who fight about everything....just makes me want to scream. Especially nitpicking type fights. I had to leave my previous workplace because of this (just one of many reasons). Fifty women, working with pregnant/laboring women, gives nice a back drop for gossip/nitpicking spats.

On the other hand, I AM able to cry. But only by myself. I HATE crying in front of people. It just makes me want to run. I have a suspicion where this came from since I wasn't allowed to cry during my punishments as a kid. For example, no matter who the person is, I can NOT cry in front of someone with authority without fear. That includes the therapist, husband, older sibling, parents... I guess I cry the easiest around my children when in presence of someone.

Thanks for bringing this up, because I really didn't think it was PTSD related. That I was just a harda$$. Maybe it's something I should work on.

[Boo-Damphir]

I'm wondering too if maybe our intolerance for others extreme emotions (crying, arguing, etc.) may be related to our intolerance for too much external stimuli?
There are days when I can't stand the TV on because of the "noise." Or I have to turn the TV off when my husband is talking to me because I can't focus on him and I get aggitated.

Dealing with other people crying is tough. If you know the person well, sometimes not saying anything but putting your arm around them or your hand on theirs is immensly powerful. If you don't know them well, a simple "I'm sorry you are so sad" is appropriate. Usually when people are crying they don't need someone to diagnose and understand them, just be there for them.

[IraqVet]

I, personally, don't feel anything when others fight or are sad or angry. Sometimes, I feel almost like I should laugh in their face at their ridiculous feelings of importance. As a veteran, I guess I have a very different idea of what makes a person sad, angry, upset etc.
It might sound arrogant, but I almost feel like I have that right - to feel like their problems are nothing. And to protect myself, I try not to feel apathy because then I will be hurt along with the other person. It is better just to feel numb to it. Distrust is your best protection in the world against being betrayed.
I guess this didn't help, but I hope you know that we understand.

[anthony]

Arrrrr emotions... a very topical subject and one that is very near the root of a sufferers ability to heal or not.

My two cents into this. We can throw parts of solutions around in regard to symptoms and emotions, but the core root to the problem as I see it and know it, is Black & White thinking. People think that black and white thinking is only related to thought. Well, emotions are part of the thought process, and that is where they become clouded. Do I feel, don't I feel. If I feel, how much pain will it cause me now? The thoughts are fast and instant, and often made without really reviewing the entire scenario.

Those without PTSD look outside the box (the box being black and white thinking) because they are not limited to two styles of thinking, instead they have the open forum of range and effect to choose, view and decide. Involve PTSD, you then involve black and white thinking, do I, don't I; Yes, No; If I, Will I; etc. Reasoning along the normal spectrum looks more like: I am angry at that person, because they are making me very frustrated at the moment; or, that person scared me then, which isn't a very nice thing to do; etc. You can see the difference between black and white thinking vs. using the entire thought spectrum to analyse emotions.

IraqVet raised an interesting point though about being a veteran.
As a veteran, I guess I have a very different idea of what makes a person sad, angry, upset etc. It might sound arrogant, but I almost feel like I have that right - to feel like their problems are nothing. And to protect myself, I try not to feel apathy because then I will be hurt along with the other person. It is better just to feel numb to it. Distrust is your best protection in the world against being betrayed.
You see, a veterans emotional state has nothing to really do with the actual impact of war itself, because their emotional reasoning was stripped already at basic training. You are taught to hate the enemy, feel nothing, walk, talk, run, climb, swim, tie your shoe laces, etc etc. You as an individual are removed during Army training and replaced with an instinctive thought of team. A group does not have emotions, only individuals have emotions. Soldiers aren't even aware of this at the time, and most never aware of it even after.

The battlefield is never left at the battlefield, it is carried within. Being a soldier is never left when you sign off your military service, as it still continues with you because it proved effective in saving you and seeing you return home, hence to the solider this is more important than emotions which where stripped during basic training. You see, this thought pattern is acceptable and required on the battlefield, it is not however an effective means of life after the battlefield though, and seeing that, and changing that is as big as healing trauma itself.

This is why deprogramming as such is becoming more topical now within the military to ensure soldiers are deprogrammed to some extent when leaving the military. The Australian military do it to a small degree now on discharge with mandatory courses and lectures, bringing you from military thinking to civilian thinking, though they never complete it because if they need you again, it is easily achieved for them to have you combat ready again.

Anyway, I could write a novel on this topic alone, but maybe some may see some scope in the above, maybe not, it is an individual choice. What you must know though, is that its not ok to be emotionally numb, its not ok to not feel anymore, regardless whether it saved you before, because emotions are the very backbone to why we carry PTSD itself, in that we failed to process them when they where presented, instead we pushed them aside, hence obtaining PTSD itself from suppressing emotions. Being vulnerable is not a weakness, it is a human trait. If you do not accept you are vulnerable, then you are trying to not accept that your human.

[batgirl]

Wow thanks again everyone for contributing to this thread. I have enjoyed reading the posts and feel relieved that I relate to so much of what's being said.

Boo-Damphir, I loved your explanation of problems with emotions, and I agree with you about the external stimuli. Most of the time I hate loud noises. Also things happening really fast... like flashing lights or fast images on TV, or fast traffic, bother me on occasion. Fireworks are especially bad for me, because they are bright and loud. On holidays I tend to hide in my room...

Nam, I feel the same way, I think people get emotional about silly things. I guess though that it doesn't take as much energy for them as it does for me. I envy and dislike people for that. And I also don't like to cry or be angry in front of others. It terrifies me. I feel like I have to be in control, especially when others are around. If not, either they will hate me, or maybe I will "lose it" like my dad did. Sometimes I feel afraid of that, too.

IraqVet, I'm not a veteran, but I relate on some levels to what you said. I'm not sure if it's because my dad was in the military or because of my own PTSD... but anyways what you wrote makes a lot of sense to me, especially the words, I almost feel like I have that right - to feel like their problems are nothing, is a really good way of describing how I often feel.

Anthony, thanks again for sharing about the military. You've touched on more points I never even thought of, like being trained not to feel anything. My father talked about some aspects of his work, but not all. So it's good to be able to fill in some blank spaces. Also I never really thought of PTSD thinking as being black and white, but it's a really good analogy. Just one more thing to work on, I guess! Sigh.

[reallydown]

"Most of the time I hate loud noises. Also things happening really fast... like flashing lights or fast images on TV, or fast traffic, bother me on occasion. Fireworks are especially bad for me, because they are bright and loud. On holidays I tend to hide in my room..."

Thanks for posting that Batgirl, I feel the same way...I hear you on the fireworks and firecrackers...they just sound too much like gun shots...or, if they're really close, like bombs going off or whatever...they just bring on all sorts of crap...

I also feel like I have to be in control especially when I'm not alone...no crying allowed kind of thing...and again, I also have reasons to fear what might happen in a fit of rage...

[batgirl]

Thanks for posting that Batgirl, I feel the same way...I hear you on the fireworks and firecrackers...they just sound too much like gun shots...or, if they're really close, like bombs going off or whatever...they just bring on all sorts of crap...

Yes they do sound like guns to me as well! Same thing with balloons popping, and even corks flying off champagne bottles. The worst for me though is when someone's car backfires (I think it's a bad muffler??). The first time that happened I was crossing the street at a busy intersection, and I almost fainted!! Now I usually wear headphones if I have to walk in heavy traffic. Construction can also get to me... lately they were digging up the sewer pipes on my block, digging really deep into the ground, so that the ground kind of shook and the noise was pretty intense. Maybe I should move to the country!!

[goingonhope]

You see, a veterans emotional state has nothing to really do with the actual impact of war itself, because their emotional reasoning was stripped already at basic training. You are taught to hate the enemy, feel nothing, walk, talk, run, climb, swim, tie your shoe laces, etc etc. You as an individual are removed during Army training and replaced with an instinctive thought of team.

Soldiers aren't even aware of this at the time, and most never aware of it even after.

Being a soldier is never left when you sign off your military service, as it still continues with you because it proved effective in saving you and seeing you return home, hence to the solider this is more important than emotions which where stripped during basic training. You see, this thought pattern is acceptable and required on the battlefield, it is not however an effective means of life after the battlefield though, and seeing that, and changing that is as big as healing trauma itself.

Anyway, I could write a novel on this topic

What you must know though, is that its not ok to be emotionally numb, its not ok to not feel anymore, regardless whether it saved you before,

Anthony, I find this information most interesting. Never once thought of, nor considered this. Husband was in the Marines for 4 years and this info. helps me understand (that which I couldn't previously understand, and sometimes with great frustration).

Just the other day I found myself very upset with him and soon afterwards writing it all down, for my personal journaling, just to get it out. What I wrote about was my great frustration and anger with his lack of emotional reasoning and the way he has expected me to Not Feel and to perform, perform, perform, perform...ect. Just like you said. Though I've experienced this as a pattern of expectations of his, he can shift and be flexible and it is not a daily occurance.

Last night, I persuaded him to at least listen as I read this post of yours. Though it was a challenge to keep him awake, because as soon as he sits he generally falls fast asleep, he heard much and found it most interesting as well. I find it amazing as it most definately answers questions I've had all the years I've known my husband. And over time I've grown to spot at times his thought patterns, but I couldn't put it into words, understand it or figure out the how and why?

I wish you would write a novel on this topic one day Anthony! Again, Most Interesting.

Oh, and when IraqVet said,:

"I, personally, don't feel anything when others fight or are sad or angry. Sometimes, I feel almost like I should laugh in their face at their ridiculous feelings of importance."

Sounds just like what I've been thinking and suspecting with my husband. I just now asked him if this was true of him and he nodded most definately in the affirmative.

...Amazing..Amazing..Amazing!....Real answers to real questions.

[anthony]

Hope, I am glad that this has helped you break down a barrier within your relationship. Understanding one another is the key to a solid relationship. Its all about mutual understanding and really knowing one another at great depth, when to press, when to backoff.

Lets just say, that I am going to write a lot of things here about military as a priority soon enough, because there are alot of military folks who browse this forum, though they struggle in the same areas I did, getting past their own pride from military training. Once that is gotten past and understood, they can just become themselves, jump in here and get into healing as the civilian they now are.

[Marlene]

emotional reasoning was stripped already at basic training. You are taught to hate the enemy, feel nothing, walk, talk, run, climb, swim, tie your shoe laces, etc etc. You as an individual are removed during Army training and replaced with an instinctive thought of team. A group does not have emotions, only individuals have emotions. Soldiers aren't even aware of this at the time, and most never aware of it even after.

I read this and thought 'I remember this attitude, but that was a long time ago and I'm past that'. But I couldn't get this quote out of my mind and I kept thinking on it. And I realized that the army pounds this shit so hard into your brain that you can't get it out. It's part of you. And when all of the shit was going on in my life and my whole family was family was falling apart (emotionally), I did what I had been trained to do. I sucked it up, tucked everything down deep and kept going. And it was only after I felt everyone I loved was safe and back on their feet (my mission was accomplished) that everything crashed down around me.

I talked to my husband about this last night (he's also a vet-we were both soldiers when we got married) and he agrees that you never lose your military training. I think this is a big part of the reason that part of me still feels almost guilty for 'breaking' because I wasn't supposed to. We were taught to go through it, go over it, go around it, go under it and if none of that works, blow the shit up! None of that works with PTSD.

I don't know if any of this makes any sense at all as I'm still working on wrapping my brain around this.

[anthony]

It makes perfect sense marlene...

[Kerrie-Ann]

What I wrote about was my great frustration and anger with his lack of emotional reasoning and the way he has expected me to Not Feel and to perform, perform, perform, perform...ect. Just like you said. Though I've experienced this as a pattern of expectations of his, he can shift and be flexible and it is not a daily occurance.

...Amazing..Amazing..Amazing!....Real answers to real questions.

Hope,

You should see it from my perspective. I am still military as was Anthony. He is very much like your husband in that aspect, but its worse when you are another military person because Anthony sure has no latitude there. I think in the initial stages of dealing with his PTSD it was easier for him to deal with me in this manner, because it was familiar to both of us. Used to really upset me though because I can switch off the military minded stuff easier (I guess because I don't have PTSD). I could never get my head around why he just couldn't get it.......I am your wife NOT one of your soldiers!! I am a girl and girls do cry, at home, with their husbands. It was really hard when I was on overseas deployment, he was a mess at home, I was a mess away and he just couldn't support me in any way. His attitude was, your a soldier, your on deployment, get over it and get on with it. My attitude was, you are my fiance and I am supposed to be able to expect support from you.

Now that he is out of the military its better but not perfect. If I get into a stressful personal situation and he is not up to being supportive, he just expects me to 'get on with it'. That can be really hard to take. Take for instance the birth of our first child, I had a rough time of it and if you asked him to this day I would expect him to say that I could have been emotionally tougher!! I've never asked because I am likely to give him a black eye.

[Kerrie-Ann]

getting past their own pride from military training

I'm calling you out on this one. You are not yet past your military 'pride' better but not past it!! I know, I live with you!

[Eagle3]

Boy, ya'll wouldn't believe how good it is to read this thread...I thought I was really crazy for so long, because I couldn't feel anything. I used to be incredibly empathic, i.e. could look a person in the eye and feel whatever they were feeling right along with them. But that was before my time of hell on earth. During it, I unconciously learned how to not feel emotions in order to stay sane, and it started coming through in my dreams...I would kill evil people and not feel anything. That scared me really bad, because I was always very emotional. Now, I still have trouble feeling, but I'm trying to bring some of it back. I do have to be careful though, because my dreams were so lifelike at that time (more reality there than when I was awake) that I have unknowingly mentally trained myself to seriously hurt, maybe even kill without feeling. I always have a hand on my temper, and have found ways to let some of it out w/out hurting others, but I still don't always trust myself to be able to hold back my fist.

What's really weird, though, is that I will exibit the physical responses to emotions, but I won't actually feel them. I can laugh at something funny but not feel the emotion that would cause such a response. Am I loony?

In any case, emotions are still a sticky subject for me, but progress is happening and I can't wait to be able to feel happy outside the sparring ring.

[goingonhope]

I am your wife NOT one of your soldiers!! I am a girl and girls do cry, at home, with their husbands.

His attitude was, your a soldier, your on deployment, get over it and get on with it. My attitude was, you are my fiance and I am supposed to be able to expect support from you.

If I get into a stressful personal situation and he is not up to being supportive, he just expects me to 'get on with it'. That can be really hard to take.
Just found this.....didn't realize you had posted here. Yes, hear you! Kerrie-Ann, you are his wife and not one of his soldiers. I know exactly what you mean. I too, like the idea of being able to cry at home with my husband. Though in my case, I must accept that this generally agitates him, and he seems to get afraid and may even feel inadequate. Why? I don't have any idea, and yet occassionally he surprises me. Just don't get it! If only he understood just how absolutely simple it is to show me support, even calm my tears or allow them to pass. You understand, when and if my husband takes the initiative and wraps his arms around me, sits beside me, looks at me, and really listens, he doesn't have to say or do anything else, I just melt. Feel all warm all over, feel his love. Everything makes sense and the tears come out, some words spoken about how I'm feeling and...Zip!....it all passes very quickly. It only lingers on and on when the communication is: 'I can't be bothered,' 'I'm not listening, nor care to deal with your feelings right now,' 'I'm too busy for you,' 'get over it,' 'get on with it' and 'can't you see you're seriously cramping my style.' These things f'n hurt. And, they hurt the average person very deeply. Someone like me, with PTSD and largely due to some chronic, serious f'n indifference. This sh*t feels, like torment. I won't go into why, because I'm liable to write several more paragraphs. Just trust me it has too much power over me at this stage. And why all of this, when it's so damn easy. Messages of indifference can be really, really hard to take. It hurts. Whether it's us to our husbands, our husband toward us or even us communicating this to our kids. Everyone hurts! And since none of us are perfect, nor never will be, all we'all can do is seek and look for improvement within ourselves....and then usually in most marriages, we grow, sometimes slowly...but none-the-less closer over time. And, I find my biggest influence and strength is when I'm willing to accept everything, (naturally within reason), just the way it is and work from the inside out.

....And, though I'm Again a newcomer to the acceptance of my PTSD, I had been working in the direction of it's healing, for about 2 yrs., prior to 1997, as well as, surrounded with simple principles of recovery, eversince, and always doing my best to apply them. What I've found though is that for nearly the last decade, I've been 'hacking away at the branches, and denying and missing it's roots.' ....this last parag. is off the subject, just found it spilling out....so I'll go with it.

[anthony]

Eagle, your not loony. Emotions take time, they take a lot of hard work, but it comes together. Stick with it... as you find yourself, you find emotions.