Goingonhope, everyone, and I mean everyone had done something they are ashamed of. No one is perfect and if they think they are, then ask them to walk on water.

I've done the ugliest things and I have forgiven myself, my abusers, and am learning to let it go. I love myself now because if I don't maybe no one else will.

I think you are a nice person despite cheating that blind woman. Your actions doesn't make you who you are inside. Everyone slips up from time to time. It's what is inside your heart that makes you who you are, and you seem to have a big heart from the posts I've read. Give yourself a break OK?

Peace
Tammy

This is good to hear Tammy and much to be proud of yourself for. I am currently sifting, sorting, separating and identifying all my stuff and I've been finding in all of it self-forgiveness and the process of letting go. I mean really letting go, like you. As for forgiving my abusers I'm not even yet sure how well, I've done with this, bc I've done exceptionally well in the past when I blamed myself for everything and now that I've been confronting my trauma(s), quite honestly I think and vent in written form some very mean thoughts about them. And, yet all I'd ever wish or really want for them is wellness and life.

Also, Tammy, good going on the self-regard and love aspect. —That one's still a real tough one for me in some areas.

Now excuse me for a min., but this really sounds odd to me, and all in the same sentence. But Tammy, I get what you've actually said here and appreciate your kind words. The point here is who I am today and my serious wrong doing then, some 20 yrs. ago, simply does not define whom and what I've become.

In fact I'm certainly different and have been worlds away from many selfish, wrong behaviors and now for many yrs.

Thank you, Tammy!

......

Hope

Hi Hope,
I think that I have forgiven my abusers, but I still have to work through the crap they have done to me. Some times this confuses me, and makes me wonder if I really have forgiven them. Maybe there is a bit of denial about that on my part?

Actually I don't think I have forgiven my step mother now that I got real honest with myself after reading your post. I didn't even realize she was one of my abusers until about six months ago.

I have days where I feel forgiveness toward them, and then something pops up that makes me wonder if I really have forgiven them fully.

I believe I have to take back what I said about forgiving my abusers, because I don't think I have fully forgiven a few of them. Hmmmm?


Peace
Tammy

um, Tammy, i don't know... i believe that you are taking responsibility for something you shouldn't. i don't think you're "taking money from them". you are doing your job, and not holding anybody at gunpoint. it's them who choose to GIVE YOU the money. it's their choice not to spend it on their families, not yours. so i don't think it's your wrong, but theirs.

Hi Vera,
I feel that I have a moral obligation to these wives and children. If I don't know the circumstances of the person giving the money, I'm blindly turning my head and pretending it's OK. I certainly wouldn't like it if I was flat broke and my daughter and I were starving while my husband was spending his paycheck to get his jollies by watching a girl get naked.

I would have to think he needs to get his priorities straight. Now, I understand that everyone deserves a break, and moderation is the key, but to do this on a regular basis (which I've seen a lot of) I can't agree to it.

I think taking money from some one who should be using their money for their children is wrong (for me). I don't judge anyone who chooses to do this though. It's just a matter of personal opinion. I don't hold this against myself from my past. I just wouldn't do it in the future, unless my daughter or I were literally starving and on the verge of death.

Peace
Tammy

OK, not going into all the details posted but I have to speak up. No where in any strip joint or "gentlemen" club is a stripper given money. You earn every frigging dollar with sweat and humiliation. On guys who should spend their cash on families... Not many guys who are actually single go in them except parties. They mostly have families and escaping them for fantasy BS. You are certainly not going to feed anyone or yourself with those limits. Hell, I had my ex who owed a shit load of back child support boycotted and girls scatter like roaches. Funny he gave me money then! Gee and he had a ruined evening. Sorry but it is a BS mentality to think you are "given" that money. Not a nice way to earn it but it is certainly earned! You will make a lot more at Mc Ds with the thought of no family men. Y'all do not think guys actually tell the truth in there do you? They lie more than the strippers! OK, off my soap box.

i'm sorry veiled, i didn't mean "give" like in "here, it's a present", i meant "giving" as in freely agreeing to take part in a transaction, as opposite to something being taken from you without your consent.

sorry if i upset you.

No, it is not just what you said, I think it is the lightly touched stripper posting in passing and seeing so much bullshit in it all spoken of honestly. I mean I was in strip joints for so long... And this is an admitting thread. A coming clean. To speak of obligations to families of clients is just bull shit. I see bull I call it. Rubbed me wrong sure, but hell call a spade a spade. Strippers would not be able to cover there nightly payout if worried about customer's families! Guess it all rubbed me wrong. If you strip currently or have be honest. You are cut throating and slick. You are a quick talker and can talk a lot of BS. That is the job along with be cute naked and keep your balance drunk in 6 inch heels. If you are at the point of stripping you are hard up and caring for yourself and/or family. No one does it "just because" it is a job, who in the hell really says I want to grow up and be a stripper? If you are there you are going to take away babies new outfit or mommy's new dress or even rent so you can pay your own. You can BS yourself all you want this is not the case but if you are to the point you are there, well, stands to reason you will do this. It is a no brainer. So I don't really like the "moral obligation" talk. If you are morally obligated you will never go in the building. If you decide OK I will get this bad and then it is OK to check your morals at the door say so. Just don't fake morals which is what I see when terms are laid on them like I read. That was one of the things that did not click for me, hell, maybe I am missing something. I will at least admit I would do it again in a heart beat if I was as bad off as then and no doubt I have limits on my morals. I have no qualms admitting I will take food from another's kid to feed my own kids. I will take child support, rent, car notes... And knowingly as I would not be in there to be the moral police for any one else... Hell, you are are running around naked to pay your bills. I actually agree with you as in do not feel guilty for their choice to cough up the cash. They are big boys. They have to deal with their own mess when they stink of perfume broke once they get home. Strippers are just making ends meet and many paying for a habit.

Ooff... this is not a nice thread to participate in. But I see the importance of it, and I think it's a genius post. I think it's important to own up to your own wrongdoings or things you're not proud of... better than letting guilt eat you away and not admitting to and learning from it.

Okay. Me? Well, I may have to come back to this a few times.

• I stabbed my dad in the belly button with a sharp pencil when I was 4/5. I was told if I 'popped' someone with a big belly they would explode like a balloon and get stuck to the ceiling. I didn't like my dad much.
• I still find this funny, but I suppose it's wrong to?
• I took a knife and threatened to kill my dad a few years back. He took one out on me back and laughed in my face. But I terrified my mum, and now I'm not allowed to live in the same house as him when she goes on holiday. I did it because I was scared for my mum's safety, but I'm not proud of it. Mainly because I think I had it in me to actually kill him. I remember thinking that if I killed him and went to prison, it would have been worth it.
• I took an overdose.
• I ended up in a psychiatric hospital for being suicidal, and put my mum through worry no mother should have to go through. I know suicide is an awful act that would have left pain behind to those I loved. But I didn't care. Not just that time, but on so many occasions.
• As a teenager, I shoplifted.
• I sent a threatening chain letter to a girl I didn't like when I was 14, because she had bullied me the year before. I wanted to get my own back.
• I stole my mum's drink and took it to school and got drunk when I was 13.
• I once got so angry at my mum that I wanted to hit her. I walked away... but I am horrified that I wanted to hit my own mum.

I don't strip any longer and I don't intend on doing it again unless I was starving. I don't find it a bad thing to do as long as no one gets hurt. If some one gets hurt, whether it be me, the person paying for the service, or a third party then I think it's wrong.

If I had to do it again because I was starving, then of course I would lose my moral obligations at the door (common sense). But that wasn't the point I was getting at. In the past, when I did it for "EXTRA" money, I picked and chose my clients, and not at the door, in private dancing. If I'm in denial then I will see it down the road.

Firstly, I didn't drink but a handful of times while stripping and never once did drugs, so maintaining balance in those heels wasn't an issue for me. Wait, I take that back, I couldn't walk in those 5 inch heels because I'm clumsy, so I had to wear the 2 inchers. It really sucked not fitting in with the "common stripper" back then. I'm beginning to wonder if I will fit in anywhere *sigh*