Much appreciated all. Worried I wasn't making myself clear. However, very good answers! Understand the differences far better now.

Must confess now. Suppose I'm guilty of not having much sympathy for those who suffer from depression, including my own child. Stems from my own father, who was a very depressed man after Korea, and had PTSD as well no doubt. Drank himself to death. At 13 I was fatherless and being the oldest, suddenly man of the house. Had to quit school and help support the family. Felt badly about it all, imagine I was grieving. Didn't get any support though. Mother told me to suck it up. Never did understand why Father couldn't have sucked it up too. He was the adult after all. But - suppose that's where the illness part comes in. He was ill. Clinical depression likely. Still struggle with it at times, forget to not pass judgement. All of your explanations of severe depression have truly helped though.

Bec - really like your explanation of types. Evie gets both of those. Only give her a kick for the "life sucks" kind though. I can be sensitive too. ;-)

Apologies. Thought that expression was universal. Correct Veiled, not aggressive. Basically, means I give my daughter (or one of my other kids - happens to the others as well) an attitude adjustment. Evie'll be moping about the house for a few days, not going out, not doing anything. Making a nuisance of herself and generally being unpleasant to all. So. I confront her. Tell her what I think she's doing wrong and to get her arse in gear. I am gentle about it most times. Sometimes have been a bit more forceful. Usually however - simply a conversation. Nothing threatening about it. Hope that explains things.

Reckon I'm an arrogant, pushy old bastard. ;-) Thanks all for putting up with the question. Grateful for the answers, truly helped.

Jim.

Jim. One sister tells me my dad was a mean drunk but the other sister says he was depressed. Today I found his year book....He was voted by his class: one who has done most for class, most for school and most likely to succeed. He went to Japan weeks after we dropped the bomb.....Ive been told he came back a totally different man.....I wonder too if it was ptsd....Editorial in book is really deep.....talks about the war and the way america has changed...Makes me think of all our soldiers today and how we are changing them and how generations for years will be affected.

Your explanation of this helps, Jim, as I'd wondered from time to time what you meant by that! I also came from a military family with an attitude of 'suck it up,' so when I don't suck it up, I tend to get even harder on myself. Your solution sounds reasonable, and though I don't have family to do that for me, I think folks here on the forum are able to give me a kick in the arse when I need it from time to time.

Wow Dad, I never really made the connection between you dealing with your father being depressed and as a result you not understanding or empathizing with depression yourself. But that totally makes sense, thanks for sharing.

PTSD encompasses Major Depressive Disorder. It is part and parcel of PTSD. Some doctors diagnose it PTSD + MDD, some don't. The one's who don't are the correct in diagnosis. The only time the later diagnosis should be individual to PTSD is if the depressive disorder was present prior to trauma. People attempt to use this for childhood abuse, saying they where depressed before being diagnosed with PTSD, which simply means they failed to differentiate between before PTSD diangosis vs. before trauma. Obviously a child being abused will suffer depression due to the abuse, which means it is part of the PTSD, not unique.

Every person with PTSD will have depression, knowingly or not. I agree with you Jim, being a kick in the arse is the best solution. Most cannot give it to themselves, so they need it. I get a kick in the arse at times for the same thing, its the best medicine. There is a difference though IMHO between depression (laziness) and ill from anxiety which can look like depression.

I hever see myself getting into a depression. I, too, suddenly find myself in one and the intensity can be really horrifying where I could never be helped by a kick in the arse. True depression, I don t believe, ever gets resolved by any kind of kick. As far as I am concerned countless KICKS are what got me in this mess(PTSD)in the first place. Depression can be really debilitating, not like the blues

Much appreciated Anthony. Good to know I am on the right track. The kick in the arse has helped time and again. Understand the difference with anxiety, comforting her or leaving her be are the only things that work at those times.

Jim.

Dshanks, a "kick in the arse" is a metaphoric term for "being dragged out of a comfort zone and forced into another zone" such as taken out of a bedroom or home used to seclude oneself and instead taken on a walk, bike ride, outdoors type of activity, exercise, something to motivate oneself to be shown that once moving and active, suddenly depression goes away because activity creates requisite bodily aspects to promote health, energy, functionality and so forth.

People get depressed, isolate themselves, they become more depressed and so forth. When you take a depressed person and force them into going for a 5km walk; you will find the first two km's they will complain the entire time, then they shutup and say nothing, by the end you ask them how they feel and 99.9% of the time they will actually feel better. Ensure a person does this daily, then ups the anty as such to increase the pace, to push themselves and create a healthy body, healthy mind, you will actually find this stops depression in its tracks and helps a person control it even when it does become quite overwhelming.

The "blues" as such is a mild form of depression, and even that can be countered with exercise or an activity to stimulate the mind. This is what a kick in the arse means.

I know exactly where my depression comes from, i know when it started and i can almost predict when it;s going to occur. I lost my mother when i was 15, as a result i am now traumatized, suffering from PTSD, OCD, mania and depression :]

I am 23-years-old and because of these illnesses i can become a bit of a bitter, depraved asshole and have done some things that i regret every day of the week.

I have things in this world that distract me from these debilitating illnesses, for example i have a passion for film, writing and reading, so spend alot of time 'escaping' using these sources but it's the quiet moments when the depression creeps up on me, in which i can fight it off for certain periods but alot of the time it is out of my control and what negativity that goes on in my head is just there, without warning, permission or control {note: no matter how positively i think, it doesn't get rid of the negative feelings, because it's a chemical imbalance of the brain, right?}

Then i come across green tea, yes, green tea, and it's probably changed my life. So those who don't drink it, try it, it may help you. You are what you consume.

So the green tea, a healthy diet etc has decreased my depression yet my OCD and PTSD is something i cannot get rid of at this present time because i have traumatic images ingrained into my head, probably for life, which of course is what PTSD is.

But i'm not going to bemoan here about my problems because there are worse situations i can be in. I'm alive, and that's all that counts at the moment.

Zieges, I have always thought that my ptsd had come from my fathers death untill I came here and learned that it could not be from such a normal death.....my ptsd came from sexual abuse many years before my fathers death. Whenever my ptsd has been triggered it is usually been by someone else's death or someone abandoning me.....or some other trigger.....I am still learning all the different triggers I have.... I am still learning so much about my ptsd...hope you are able to get the support and help you need, as I have....peace be with you.....